jamius.com

It seems that as far as having such an awesome and creative attitude, Jamie, and the people on this board, are in the minority. Why is that? What are the main roadblocks that society would have to overcome to live in the utopian island paradise that Jamie may one day achieve? And so as to not make this a thread of complaints, let’s offer some advice on how the problems we list could be fixed. (Also, I’m definitely being biased living in the US, but other countries feel free to chime in).

Here are two which I feel are the roots of a lot of other problems:

Lack of appreciation and desire for intelligence

This is probably exemplified in the “bully beats up nerd” motif. Society in general seems to demonize learning. It’s not “cool” to read or watch educational programs. Sports are probably the first example that shows this. Name a sport and most people could name one of it’s best players: Wilt Chamberlain, Joe DiMaggio, Wayne Gretzky, Johnny Unitas, etc. But what about more mental pursuits? Maybe a few could name Bobby Fischer (a lot probably only because the movie), and maybe one percent of those could probably name Eio Sakata. Not to say that sports don’t require mental finesse, but it seems people care more about physically athletic people than mentally athletic people. And I’m not trying to put down sports, this is seen in media as well. People care more about Justin Timberlake than Richard Feynman. I could go on but I think you get my point.

I’ve always had a passion to learn new things. E.g: What are we made of? Cells? What are those made from? Atoms? Where do those come from? Stars? How are they formed? Etc. It amazes me how people can be so complacent in their ignorance. Isn’t there a spark to pursue knowledge? I mean that’s a driving force behind humanities growth. The desire to learn.

Fear of uniqueness

This is particularly bad because it stifles change. People give themselves up to society. They are scared to do anything beyond the status quo. People follow the trends of celebrities hoping to emulate their life, but forget the fact that they have their own life they could be living.

So how to fix these?

Make it okay to learn and be unique. Bring back Bill Nye and Carl Sagan and get rid of so much celebrity media. Inspire people to figure things out for themselves. Don’t just tell a kid gravity is “about 10 m/s^2”. Tell them why! Show them a demonstration! Ask them to think what would happen if its wasn’t! An don’t just do it with science. Literature: Why didn’t Hamlet kill Claudius before? Do you think it was the right decision? Discuss it as a group, don’t just lecture. Don’t just tell them The Crucible was an allegory; inspire them to figure it out. Tie it in with a history class. Etc.

So now your turn. What are some other problems and solutions for society?

Re: Sports vs. Academia in terms of pop culture.

I think the real problem is the way things are monetized, if the money that was put into sports and entertainment was put into academia and research there would be more interest in pursuing careers in those areas!

I agree with your points. I think it's ridiculous that athletes get paid millions of dollars simply to play a game while top scientists still have to hunt for grants. (OK maybe not the top scientists but you get my point.) And I'm not saying this because I'm a nerd who hates athletes. I am an athlete, who just happens to be a nerd.

If there were more incentives for people to do research, more kids would want to grow up to be scientists. Another thing is, what about the credit for inventions? Whenever scientists discover some new type of antibiotic or new subatomic particle that shakes the foundations of what we believe in, do we even know who did the experiments? Unless you read the scholarly articles, probably not. I'm sure the scientists work for some big corporation who will take the credit, but whatever happened to "Credit where credit is due"? But we all know who scored the winning touchdown last Sunday right?

This is mean when I say this, but I think society as a whole is getting dumber. I mean sure, we KNOW more things because of ongoing scientific pursuits, but knowing things doesn't necessarily mean we know how to apply our knowledge. And sure, right now we have a "highly educated (unemployed) public", but I feel that's just because college degrees have become so easy to get, they don't even mean anything anymore.

Again, sure you could go to an Ivy League school, but unless you know someone, are rich, or are a genius, you won't get in. And that depends on how you did on your "standardized tests" which are dumb to begin with. I know TONS of "smart" people who don't do well on standardized tests. They just don't think like that. People that have money just get personal tutors that essentially each them how to "cheat" the tests by telling them how to guess the best. Whatever happened to figuring the problem out for yourself without having to guess? But no, the tests are designed to trick people, and unless you know how to spot the tricks, you'll most likely get it wrong. I really think those tests (SATs, GREs, MCATs, LSATs, etc) should be overhauled to be more of a general intelligence and problem solving test. Most of the people I know who are great problem solvers can figure out just about everything, as long as they are taught the content (whether it is engineering, chemistry, economics etc.) But tests like that would require more human interaction to grade, so it'd never work.


Also, society as a whole is getting lazier. Yes, we have invented things to make our lives easier, but that doesn't mean we all have to get lazy and fat. Where the heck were the "disorders" that "make" people fat back in the day? People weren't ALWAYS fat. In fact, back when hominids were still subject to natural selection, there WERE NO fat people. (Mainly because of lack of food.) So tell me, where did these disorders come from? The VERY few disorders that actually do make people fat came from GENERATIONS of bad eaters and lazy personalities. Just because society has made anything we want available to us as food doesn't mean we can eat WHATEVER we want.


You know what really grinds my gears? I think it's hilarious how there are so many "teach your baby to do this" or "prepare your 5 year old for college" things. I mean REALLY? I don't really have anything else to say about that, I just think it's hilarious. Sure, parents want to "do the best for their kids", but do they ever realize that "the best" could be letting them grow up normally? Not pressuring them to DO MORE or BE BETTER. If a kid grows up YEARNING for academia, then they'll be successful. If they are FORCED to learn, they're going to grow up hating school and end up not wanting to be a scientist. We SHOULD be trying to instill curiosity in kids. Get them asking "Why" and "How" instead of "How long do I have to do this?". I agree, bring back Bill Nye. I LOVED him when I was a kid. I had his computer game (which was impossible for me, I think I was a bit young.) PLAY with your toddlers; give them building blocks instead of bouncers that interact with the TV. When they get old enough not to choke on things, give them LEGOs. That's one of my earliest memories. I played with Lego EVERY DAY when I was a kid. When I was a bit older, my parents bought me a little bit of Capsela.

These were expensive, so I didn't have many, but I LOVED them, I thought of SO many cool things I could make with them. Using capsula, I discovered that DC motors act as generators when spun by hand. I asked for my first voltmeter because of these toys. These are the types of things that kids need to be playing with, not video games. I was allowed to play video games when I was younger, but only a very small amount of time. It was usually at night after the sun had gone down and I had come inside for the day.


Wow have I really ranted for an hour?

In summary, I think colleges have to be more strict about admissions, parents need to ease up on the early childhood learning bull, kids need to play less video games, society needs to get off their butts and move more, and scientists need to be rewarded better.

(All of this is purely my opinion, and I'm most likely wrong about some of it. If you want to correct me, feel free, but I was not being combative in any way, so there is no need for you to be.)

I haven't read all of your post corrado but there is one thing I can disagree with (in a way). Being a teenager that used to play video games in ALL of my spare time I learnt a lot about the world. Most games are stupid to be playing for a long time at all but the reason I played for so long was mainly because I would be playing creative games. Here are some reasons some video games are great:

* I learn't about mechanics and electronics in a game called garry's mod 10. You can create set shapes and attach them together in certain ways but there is so much more than just that. I would be the best at building airplanes and I would spend hours doing it and getting things right so it worked better than the last. I had so much fun using them online to play certain game modes or just mess around with them and see what other people are building. This game was very creative and I had a lot of fun.

* Playing garry's mod online also taught me about people of the world. Through the years I would have different online friends and groups I would build stuff with and I got to interact with hundreds of complete strangers. I'm not sure how to explain it but I learned more about the world from this.

* Minecraft is what I moved to after getting hours of play out of garry's mod. If anyone knows what minecraft is you will know why its a great game. But again playing online helps to understand the world a bit better etc.

I'm tried. Its 2AM. i can't think of much to say really and those bullet points didn't really work out but hopefully you get the idea. The main problem is the people, not the games. I learnt a lot from spending so much time on the computer when other people don't look at it that way and just think its fun. I'm now moving onto build real life stuff and the games have helped inspire me to do that. I think the problem is how the children are raised so they don't get anything good like this from playing games. Everything in life has something you can learn from it and with these games there are a lot! But a will admit that I think some games are really stupid, like call of duty might be fun for a little bit but I don't see how it would be after that at all! There is a wide variety of games and lots of games are art forms. Some are good but some are crap. Thats my opinion on video games! Coming from a 16 year old! I hope that helps.

On another note I think society is like an ecosystem in the sense that you can'y just select one or two things to change, you have to change the whole thing just to change one little bit. If you take one little thing away from an ecosystem it can collapse. So to change it a bit you need to change the whole thing. Also everybody see's everything differently so lots of things I think in society are good and lots of things are bad but people might think the same for different reasons. I find that for example if I have to write an essay in an exam for stupid english at school, everybody tries to learn particular things which is silly then they forget but I just learn the whole book so if someone asked a question I could confidently answer it. This applies to everything in life like building things too. I want to learn the physics of it all not just particular tricks. If you build a society on guidelines like that instead of hard and fast one-meaning rules then it will work out in many more situations! I learned this in life but trying to figure out how people programmed video games starting with nothing, you dont make everything separate you make a set of constant rules sort of that you can fit everything inside. I hope this shows that its the 100% the person that is the problem in a way not just all the things they do.

I will be back and more conscious some other time

I have no problem with athletes making what they do. It is supply and demand. The owners shouldn't reap all the rewards.

I don't even care if people want to be educated or not. People should just be able to be what they want. The president of a company is no better than the person who takes out the trash if both are happy doing what they do. There are plenty of miserable rich people.

I would rather like to see more enabling of people. There are simple solutions to problems, but they don't get addressed. There should be no homeless in the United States and it should be easy and cheap to solve. People needing a place to live should just be given land in one of those big western states. You know the ones. They square ones that nobody knows the name of. Give them the basics of survival. You don't need a lot. If there is wood and water available, give them the tools and let them be self sufficient. No, people shouldn't be forced into this situation, but there are some of us that might prefer it over our day jobs.

I really can't add much to this thread other than saying that I think that its all in our heads.
The problems are there if you look for them, but if you don't, they are generally no longer there.
My favorite movie ever is "Harold And Maude" its worth looking up.

The job I have now pays less than 50% of the job I had a few years ago, but I really wasn't bothered by it.
In fact the only reason I know the percentage of financial disparity was because realistically, I knew that we would have to adjust things to fit the new life.

You adjust, and move on.

It may look to some like Jamie has the perfect life, but that’s only because he thinks it is. And if you think it is, it is.

I think the reason that people are so accepting of their own ignorance is the years spent in state run schools. Look at the difference in curiosity between a 4 year old, and a 12 year old. ...and an 18 year old.

First i should clarify that I'd consider almost all "private" schools to be stat run, as well as public schools. The state defines the rules for certification, and all that garbage. A large part of that "education" is to convince people that only schools certified by the government are worth anything. Its a vicious cycle.
I remember being in school, and every step of the way I was scolded by teachers for my creativity. Luckily I was super stubborn, and did my own thing not matter how much punishment came along. My parents offered no help. They'd been indoctrinated by years of schooling to the point where they couldn't see any options in life other than going to a "good" school to get a "good" job that pays lots of money.

People tell me that it's human nature to be stupid, and destructive. I disagree. It it was natural for us, we wouldn't need 12+ years of oppressive thought control to make people be that way. We start out wanting to learn. ...not having any interest in fighting. I talk with a lot of parents, and they almost always say the same thing.... Boy just want to FIGHT! I ask them at what age it starts, and it always coincides with their start of school. Its horribly sad! ...and most people are completely blind to it because the very thing that is turning them stupid is the thing that tells them it makes them smart.

Solutions? For me, I tell people what I think of the system regardless of how unpopular a view it may be. ....and I've been surprised at how many people happen to agree. ...but think they have no choice in how to live.

jamius wrote:I think the reason that people are so accepting of their own ignorance is the years spent in state run schools.. ...

Fortunately for me, I have a learning disability, so I was able to see the school system for what it is (or was) from square one. Things actually got better for me as I got older (Around ten) and I realized that they can kill you, but they can't eat you. (With time, things get better)

The best day of my life was graduating from high-school and stepping out of the educational system for good.
(Ironic that I'm back in it, but this time in a staff worker dog capacity...)

Anyhow, the farther in the past school is, I find the more creative I have become. (At least in my mind.)
The scars of a piss poor educational system are still there, but they fade a little more every day.

I do my best to teach my grandson a bunch of stuff like welding, cutting out little hearts for his mother out of steel with a plasma cutter, and operating equipment of all kinds. Life skills that I wish I had when I could have used them.

For me, its not about what I lost, but how I can make it better for the next generation, I believe the system can be fixed, it just takes time.

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